James Barry - Episode 32

Animal Organs - Nature's Multi-Vitamin

In this episode, James Barry talks about Animal Organs - Nature's Multi-Vitamin



James Barry’s 16+ years in the culinary field started as a private chef. His inauguration into restaurant-style cooking came later when he was the vegan/vegetarian chef on the Van’s Warped Tour, which traveled to 50 North American cities in 60 days. Upon returning to Los Angeles, James continued to private chef and had the fortune of cooking for celebrities such as Tom Cruise, Mariska Hargitay, George Clooney, Gerard Butler, Sean “Puffy” Combs, Barbra Streisand, and John Cusack. Not wanting to limit the audience of his healthy and tasty style of cooking, James started Wholesome2Go, a healthy, high-quality food delivery company that served under his leadership in the Los Angeles area for 8 years. Most recently, James launched his first functional food product, Pluck, an organ-based, all-purpose seasoning. It's the first of its kind and an amazingly easy and delicious way for people to get organ meats into their diet. James also co-authored the recipes in Margaret Floyd’s book Eat Naked and co-authored the follow-up cookbook The Naked Foods Cookbook. He most recently co-authored the recipes in Dr. Alejandro Junger’s book, Clean 7. Follow James on Instagram and Facebook at @eatpluck.


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Evan H. Hirsch, MD  0:00  
Hello and welcome to the fix your fatigue podcast. Whether you can't get out of bed in the morning, your energy crashes throughout the day, or you're a bio hacker looking to optimize your energy, productivity and focus. This podcast is for you. I am Dr. Evan Hirsch. And I will be your host on your journey to resolving fatigue and optimizing your energy. And we'll be interviewing some of the top leaders in the world on the tee resolution. Welcome.


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  0:33  
Hey, everybody, welcome back to the fix your fatigue podcast. I'm so glad that you're here with me today. Today we're going to be talking with my friend James Berry, about this cool new thing that he has created. I don't know how new it is, but I'm really digging it on my food and we're gonna be talking more about it. But first, let's learn about James. So James berry 16 plus years in the culinary field started as a private chef. his inauguration into restaurant style cooking came later when he was the vegan vegetarian chef on the Vans Warped Tour, which traveled to 15 North American cities in 60 days, which is interesting because of this product we're going to be talking about today. Upon returning to Los Angeles, James continue to private chef and had the fortune of cooking for celebrities such as Tom Cruise, Mariska Haggerty are Hargitay rather, George Clooney, Gerard Butler, Sean Puffy Combs, Barbra Streisand and john qussuk. And because of all this, he can act he can sing and he can rap. I just made that up, not wanting to limit the audience of his healthy and tasty style of cooking. James started wholesome to go highly healthy, high quality food delivery company that served under his leadership in the large Los Angeles area for eight years. Most recently, James launched his first functional food product pluck an Oregon based all purpose seasoning. It's the first of its kind and an amazingly easy and delicious way for people to get organ meats into their diet. James also co authored the recipes and Margaret Floyd's book, eat naked and co authored the follow up cookbook, the naked foods cookbook. He most recently co authored the recipes and Dr. Alejandro youngers book clean seven. James Singh. Thanks so much for hanging out with me today.


James Barry  2:21  
Yeah, thank you for having me. I appreciate it.


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  2:25  
So let's talk about pluck. I got it right here. I'm totally digging on it. What is pluck?


James Barry  2:30  
Yeah, and so it's I know, it's kind of a, I sometimes have trouble not stressing this because it's it I just am so still amazed that I created something that hasn't been done before. Because it's just, it's just incredible to me, because every It feels like everything's been done, you know, in today's day and age. And so unless it's like laboratory, you know, made or something like that. But this is all just real foods, and no one had combined them in this way. But I took freeze dried powdered organs, organ meats that you would find in supplement form. If you take taking capsulated organ meats, the same ingredient, I'm sourcing it from the same places as they are in New Zealand. It's grass fed grass finished really high quality, no GMOs. And, and I just had this idea. I was like, Well, people have issues around eating organ meats, they associate it with the icky taste, they don't, they've lost the art of cooking it. Or they just don't want to deal with the slime Enos or something like that. And if they do know they need to be taking it. They're taking supplements, but they're just not consistent with it. They forget to take their supplements. So I, I just, I was fortunate enough to have this idea. And I combined it with spices and herbs. So that I offset that kind of that taste that whatever that tastes some people would say it's metallic, some people say it's little meaty, I don't I don't know. It's different for everyone. So I can't really quantify or qualify it for everyone. But I was able to offset that taste with these herbs and spices. And now you can basically get the nutrition of origami just like you would salt and pepper you can salt pepper your food instead of using salt, pepper use pluck, and now you've upped the nutritional content of whatever you added to and I joke I'm like, you can you don't have to know how to cook with Gluck. Like if you're eating McDonald's, just sprinkle it on McDonald's. Like I'm not advocating McDonald's, but I'm not gonna judge you for what you're eating. I'm just saying, look, we need this nutrition we need. We need organ meats in our diets. And this is a really easy way to get it.


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  4:34  
Yeah, so tell me more about that. So like why organ meats? Why do we want more organ meats in our diet?


James Barry  4:39  
Yeah, well, you know, I emphasized second ago, like oh, well, if it's not laboratory made, and I I've been in this business, as you mentioned, when you read my bio, like over 16 years, and I've seen I feel like I've seen it all in terms of diets. I mean, I've worked with intuitive nutritionists. Can you believe that? So these are nutritionists. Why?


James Barry  5:00  
I shouldn't even say nutritious, I don't think they're actually licensed or registered nutritionist or anything like that there are people that work with celebrities and, and they are intuitive. So they're, they're feeling they're able to kind of use their energy powers to assess what foods this person should be eating. So I feel like I've seen it all. And the one thing I always go back to is like, there's all these dietary trends, but the things that to me that stick are these real foods, these foods that have just been a part of our society that that aren't coming from nature.


James Barry  5:34  
Those are the things that aren't trends. In my perspective, like that's just, that's just like we the power of the sun goes into the grass, we can't digest that grass cows can and they do it in a beautiful, natural way when they're fed grass, and not soy and all that other crap that they're fed when they're in there in conventional farms. But when they're fed naturally, it's like they are able to assess those nutrients. So I look at organs as nature's multivitamin. And I mean, some of the vitamins that you would find in in organs, there's vitamin A, there's B, there's see there's D, there's E and K, there's essential minerals like iron and calcium, copper, magnesium, phosphorus, potassium, zinc. And when you look at this list, a lot of it, it's like, wait, this is a lot of stuff that's in prenatal vitamins. Right? So I'm like, Well, yeah, this is nature's multivitamin, if it's in prenatals, we know this is what's needed to create life. And here it is. It's It's It's, it's, it's there for our taking, and yet we're not taking it. And so the question is, will Why? And how can I help you do that?


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  6:45  
That's brilliant. Yeah, I totally. I totally believe in that model. Like the closer we get to nature, the better you know, and I keep picturing was a Dances with Wolves like reaching in and pulling out the heart or something like that. And like, the leader gets the heart. So like, What is? So there's a lot of nutrients that sounds like that are in these things. But is there? I don't know is there more than just nutrients in in organ meats? I don't know a ton about them. So if you do, if you can educate me, that would be great.


James Barry  7:16  
Well, so every so you're bringing up x, I love that you brought up Dances with Wolves, because there is this ancestral, because really what we're talking about is ancestral eating. That's the kind of label that people give this type of food. And I am a huge proponent of ancestral eating. And I think the closer we can get to those basic foods as past foods, the easier it is for our bodies to assimilate and digest it. You know, like I was just, this is kind of a tangent. But aspartame is something that Donald Rumsfeld who just died, he was one of the CEOs of the company that created that when and he's one of the people that helped get it through the FDA. And he did it in very underhanded and back backdoor deal ways. But he made a lot of money off of that. And we know for a fact, so aspartame is laboratory made, and it's caused havoc on people's gut habit and in lots of cancer. And in fact, he even died of cancer, which is kind of ironic. But when you think of like when I think of laboratory foods, I think of I get scared, I really get scared because it's like, well, we're not tested, we don't know, we just we don't know, we can isolate things. And we can think Well, okay, they did this with a glass of glyphosate, you know, they did this with with Roundup, they isolate and said, Oh, as long as humans don't get this amount in their diet, there'll be okay. But then they didn't, they didn't factor in the fact that we're getting it not from that one source, we're getting it from 50 other sources because it's in the soils, it's in the water. It's It's It's, it's, it's showing up in all these places. And now we have this petri dish of chemicals in our body, and no one can measure those, no one could have planned for that. Right. And so that's why I always I look towards ancestral eating, because to me, it's like, you can't mess with that that has been there for 1000s of years. It's like, we know that these things work. And so the fact that you brought up dance to the wolves is really powerful, because there's this concept of an ancestral eating that's like, supports like. So the idea is that if I eat the heart of an animal that it's going to support my heart. If I eat the liver of an animal, it's going to support my liver. And you can look at our health right at our health as society it is it is declined. And of course, it's really hard to say like, Well, why it's really hard to isolate that but I personally can't help but connect the dots between Well, we used to eat the whole animal, the nose to tail we used to eat every part of it. And the muscle meat was not the primary goal of killing an animal. I mean, as you mentioned with dance wolves, they are, they went for the heart and the I've heard that from hunters like hunters, or in even in these kind of in tribes, it's still existed in the world. When they kill an animal, it's sacred. It's not just it's not this flippant thing, it's very sacred moment, they honor the animal that that was killed, they take the organs a lot of time it is the heart or they'll eat something raw right there for the kill as a way of like, honoring the process, the journey that it took to do this, and and then also to revitalize their journey in terms of if they expend a lot of energy, you know, to kill the animal, whatnot, it helps replenish their energy. I think similar to like a mama cat, like when a cat has its kittens, it will knock on the placenta, because the placenta has been said to provide reread, provide more nutrition and kind of revitalize the mother who had just given birth that concept.


James Barry  10:58  
So there was just such a different way of doing it. And so I can't help but think like, well, are we are we having all these chronic issues? Because we're not eating nose to tail? Are there are there connections, and I know there's a lot of health practitioners out there that believe that. So my my goal is a as a entrepreneur, and as a bit as a business owner, and someone that as I said, has been in this industry for a long time. My goal is like, well, how can I get everyone back to that way of eating because there are those hurdles that I already mentioned the not knowing how to cook the things the hurdle of just the shakiness and sourcing and all that stuff. So so how can I make that easier. And that's why in pluck, I put five organs so it has liver, kidney, heart, spleen, and pancreas. And pancreas, for example, has a lot of enzymes in it. And each organ kind of supplies some crossover, a liver being the most nutrient dense, but that they all have a little bit of crossover. But then there's other organs that are higher in something else. So like the spleen, for example, is high in vitamin C, you know, whereas the liver is not as much kidney is rich and B vitamins like b 12, b nine B two. And it's a great source of heme iron, as is the deliver. So the more I can get us back to that knows to tell eating the better in my opinion.


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  12:26  
I love that. And I love that idea of of nose to tail makes me want to make me want to create a restaurant called Mr tail or something like that,


James Barry  12:36  
When something we're kind of, we're more and more connecting to is. And this is ultimately an encapsulation or what I just said is so whole body helps to create a whole human like the whole eating the whole animal is going to support our whole whole human health like the whole nice whole animal, whole body, whole whole animal full human. And I'm just more and more just seeing like, we can't sidestep this stuff. You know, we I think we're always looking for that magic pill. And I think that's one of the reasons we have so many chronic health issues. Like look at sugar I love I love talking about sugar, because I think it's hilarious, like hilarious and set. So if you look at all the different diets that have come out over the years, why now the popular one is like keto and carnivore is kind of increasing, right. But what's the first thing that happens when a new diet get introduced to the azygous to the society? What's the first thing you start seeing the most posts on it's how do I eat this diet with desserts? So right now, it's all about keto desserts, keto desserts, you know, are plant based desserts, because plant based is the new word for vegan, right? So it's like, it's like, how can I eat this diet but still get my fix? And I just think that's interesting, because it's like, are we you know, what are we doing? Like, we're just going from 111 thing to the next but we're still we're still addicted, we're still we're still not dealing with the actual issues at hand, which is, you know, the sugar addiction or the opiate addiction, whatever it is it the kind of addiction to the hole that we have. And that's why I think going back to whole animal could save us in many in many regards.


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  14:22  
Yeah, I absolutely agree. And I think it's and if you look back evolutionarily like how are we getting our sugars? It was berries. totally right. And then if you look at some of the native populations, what would they do? They would mix the berries in with the meat. Yeah, right. And they preserve them or whatever.


James Barry  14:38  
Yeah, have you ever had there's a there's a name for that. I'm skipping on the name right now and it's funny I was just talking about the other day they were you take the meat. So you take me you can take ground me you dry it, you know you you air dry it and then or dehydrate it and then you can combine it with other dehydrate things and you make and you make basically like Make a cake out of it. So it's all dried. It's still raw in a sense, but you're making a cake out of and that's how they did it back in the past. And I Gosh, I wish I could remember the name. I know someone who's gonna be listening to this. It's gonna be screaming at the screen going like it's this. It's this. But I just want it's given the name.


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  15:16  
Yeah I think so. There's the there's the Tonka bytes. There's and they think they combined bison with, with a number of different majors cranberries, I can't remember.


James Barry  15:26  
There is it's pemmican is that what's called the hem panic. And that's what it's called I yeah, I just remember it's a pumpkin. It's a paste of dried and pounded meat mixed with melted fat. So you have to it's equal parts, dried meat and drive and fat, not dry fat, but fat and it preserves it and they found pemmican. So this is how back in the day people would travel. Like, you know, like we talked about, what did you take on the plane for food? Well, this is how they traveled. So they would be on horseback or whatever. And they would have their cakes, they're fat and protein. And sometimes there would be berries in there. And you can mix different things in there. But that is what sustain them. And it's fascinating because pemmican they have found pemmican that's hundreds of years old, and it's still good. Whoa, yeah, it's insane. I mean, it's the same thing with honey, right? Because fat and honey, those are preservatives, their natural preservative. So they've found I think it was in Egyptian tombs, they found honey or something that was also still good. I mean, so it's, it's, this is the real food man. It's like, it doesn't disappoint. It doesn't. It either naturally, goes bad, which is a good thing. Or it preserves forever, and you don't need all these other kinds of things. So it's just, it's incredible. When you when you look at how that when you take when you harness the power of the human body. And you combine it with these powerful foods, these real natural foods these powerful, you know, godly foods, whatever you want to call it. We are we equal greatness. I mean, it's just amazing. But it's when we contradict these things when we try to outsmart the food and outsmart the body. I think that's where we go wrong. Right?


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  17:09  
Yeah. What do other carnivores do? They eat the whole animal. They're great. There's a reason for that they're not spitting out certain parts, certain organs that they don't want, right?


James Barry  17:18  
No, I mean, if you don't, you're you could get severely nutrient deficient. I mean, because you can't get all the nutrients you need from just the muscle meat. You just can't.


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  17:29  
Yeah, and one of the things that I really like about the product is how clean it is organic free range, because it's really important with some of these filtering organs like liver and kidney, right that if they're not living a healthy light life, if they have a lot of exposures, then potentially you're eating that so to take take me through that process. Why was that important to you?


James Barry  17:52  
Yeah, sourcing of any I mean, anytime you look at animals, you really need to think about how you're sourcing because because it's the we there is a myth that people think that the organs are also where we store the toxins. So the organs are the filtration for this toxins, but actually the storage places the fat of the animal. So either way, doesn't matter. Okay, you know, even what I just said, doesn't truly matter in terms of sourcing you still you got to think of the whole animal like how is this animal being fed? What is it being fed? What is the environment it's living in? Is it a stressful environment? Because even stress is going to affect what's in the meat, the hormones that are in the meat? And so when you are I always emphasize focus on those qualities. So if you're going to spend your dollars on anything like and you're and you are an omnivore, spend it on me like, like buy the highest quality meat, because that to me is going to be kind of the thing that moves your health meter better than if you spend it on. I mean, I don't even know what else like on some contraption or if, if you're so worried about you know, organic vegetables I mean, I think it's important to get it that organic vegetables even nowadays, but I would still put more emphasis on the meat the quality of it, but to your point, if the animal is not healthy, the organs then are not working properly. And so then they become they do become a storage and or a toxic burden on that animal. I mean, you know, this is a fascinating fact is so chickens, for example. And in the in in our in our nation. The US chickens are sourced from only a handful of companies basically control the chicken. They're called the chicken mafia. They basically control how chickens are done. And so the breed of chicken there.


James Barry  20:02  
Something people don't actually connect or know about. So that we were talking about that the health of the, I'm sorry, I'll start it cleanly. So a lot of people don't know this about chickens. So chickens, the breed of the chicken is controlled by the chicken mafia, they call it so it's like seven or nine companies, like, you know, the big the big company, chicken companies out there, they control what chickens are available people and these chickens are bred to get really large, quickly on certain food, their breasts heavy, so they don't have a lot of dark meat. And they don't because of this, they're because they're they're bred to grow really quickly. They also don't have a lot of nutrition and or flavor to it. Because flavor equals nutrition typically, and, and food. And so what happens is, the chickens in any us typically are only grown to seven weeks. So the chickens, you're buying conventional chickens you're buying in the grocery store are seven weeks old, which is incredible, right? So they fatten them up that fast, but their organs can't keep up. So you know what the number one way these chickens die, before they get to market is because they have heart attacks. Wow. Because their organs, they still have a seven week old heart. But their body is like a 300 pound Baby, you know, it's like you got to think of it like that, like imagine a little baby a seven week old baby, that's 300 pounds. And that seven week old baby still has a seven week old heart. That's what's happening to chickens. And so that's an that's an example of like, I would not eat a conventional chicken heart. You know, I mean, like, cuz you got to think what is the burden that is happening on those organs? When this bird is being grown? It's such an exceedingly high rate, you know, the burden that's happening? And what food is it eating to make it grow that that quickly? And I mean, and what what what are the, what are the elements of what they're eating. And then of course, the environment is also an issue. So these, these animals are so big that they can't, you know, people always like, Oh, I wish my chickens were free range. It's like, well, these chickens, they wouldn't want to go outside. Because they're so heavy. If they when they walk, the bones can't actually hold the weight room. So they're there, their bones are buckling. And so a lot of them prefer to be in the shade of the sheds, that they keep them in indoors and the cool air, they don't want to go outside. So a lot of them wouldn't choose to go outside if you gave them that option. But that's this specific type of conventional chicken I'm referring to. But either way, I think it answers that question of like, yeah, you have to think about the quality of this animal. Like if you if this animal is not like, you know, we were talking about like supports, like in terms of organs? Well, I say the same thing about the animal, the health of the animal equals your health. Just look at it like that if the animals not healthy, you're not gonna be healthy. And that's just done conversation over in. I mean..


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  23:01  
Yeah, what's interesting is that people will react to the foods that the animals that they're eating have been fed. So they have to be very careful. I know that. Yeah, I've seen it time and time again, with with clients and patients over the years where they'll say, you know, if I get my, I gotta get my cow over here. Because of the, the, the feed that they're getting doesn't work over here, if they're buying locally, or whatever it is. So I think that's such an important part of this, because whatever they're eating, and whatever their environment is, pesticides or whatnot, are getting inside, every single aspect, every single cell, right, whether it's the organs or the meat, or whatever. And so it's just, it's so much more important to source and so the new source from New Zealand bovine Is that right?


James Barry  23:46  
Yeah, I saw I saw New Zealand is an island, one of their huge imports, I should say, exports, one of the huge exports is is their, their cow, you know, they're they're the animal they and they utilize, they've created a whole economy around the organs around the meat around the dairy. I mean, so they utilize the whole animal and so they are that their industry is very hell bent on making sure that it's a contained and controlled environment. So they don't do GMOs. They're there they're able to actually grass so when we say grass fed, all, all cows are grass fed. I mean that this is something a lot of people don't understand. Every cow, whether it's conventional or not, is grass fed. The key is are they grass finished? And is it green grass, because most areas in the world they can't they can't grow grass, you know, year round, you know that the grass has a has a has a harvest time. And so that means it's green during part of the year and then the rest of time it's they're having to subsidize the grass. It's it's not green. It's you know, it's hay basically and then having to subsidize it with other stuff and then a lot That's corn or soy or something like that. And that's not true New Zealand, New Zealand, they actually can have the grass year round. So when most of the supplements in in the US are being purchased from New Zealand, of Oregon of organ meats are being purchased from New Zealand, and that's also something I'm, I'm hoping to change with my companies, I'm really trying to establish a more domestic supply chain of origami here because we have we have farms in the US that they're doing it right, they're doing it well, they're raising these animals correctly, but we don't have a supply chain to get their organs we that one of the issues is that a lot of the slaughterhouses in the US, the meat processing companies, they won't even allow the the rancher who brings their cow there to get all the organs like in New Zealand, they're utilizing everything. And I'm not saying that the conventional are these are these slaughterhouses are not utilizing everything, they are utilizing everything. They're incredibly efficient. They're just not utilizing everything for human consumption. They're using it for pet food, or they're using it to re feed the animals like a lot of you know this, what is it that cow? The weather called mad cow disease. I mean, that came about because they were taking the the leftovers of the sick animals. So when an animal would die, they would break it down. And they would take some things and different organ meats and different things like that different parts of the animal, and they would refit it to healthy animals, and then they would all get sick. So they're, you know, it's not that the system doesn't exist here. It's just not being used for human consumption. And that's something I'd really like to try to change.


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  26:43  
Yeah. And so is there a specific way that the animal needs to be killed in order to preserve the organs appropriately?


James Barry  26:50  
You know, that's a good question. I mean, I know, I know that of course, there's there's kosher way. You know, kosher is interesting, because a lot of people think kosher equals healthy. And it does, it's just it's specifically what you said, it's just the way the animals kill, you know, if they don't let it they let the blood drain. And of course, also, there's a rabbi there to, to oversee it. But it doesn't have anything to do with how the animal was fed, how it was raised the environment that it existed in before it got there. Think for the organs as far as I know, it just has to be done quickly like it they have to be processed in a way and the key with any animal and I mentioned this a little while ago, but but it didn't really go into it which is the stress of the animal like Temple Grandin, graden Grandin, she was the one that revolutionized the, the cow and you know the how cows were killed basically because she recognized that when you have it when you have it where the cow just is stressed out and going to be slaughtered. We now know that the the hormones that come up from that that fight or flight hormones, they actually changed the the chemistry of the of the meat, like the nutritional load of the meat. So she's the one that devised a more humane way of getting animals to slaughter and I and I've talked to a bunch of small farmers and you know, like Joel Salatin of polyface Farms, he'll say like, you know, these these animals that can talk about his pigs or something they'll say like, these pigs lead amazing lives, they just have one bad day.


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  28:35  


James Barry  28:37  
And, you know, this is kind of an interesting point. I have to bring this up because I love that you talked about it is that you were talking about, you know, what these animals are fed, you know, like the environment they're being raised that we have to think about that that's, that's whatever they're eating is what is going into their meat right. And I found that so fascinating because a friend of mine who lives in Virginia You know, a lot of times we think well if we get wild game it's gonna be healthier. You know? Like a lot of people say like, okay, the cow industry is tainted and you have to only you can only get it from a healthy place small ranches that are doing it what right, but it's really expensive. So I sometimes buy venison or I go hunting and I co Kill Kill the animals myself, right. But he made this point of like, what do you think those Venice like, what do you think the deer in the Venice not they're eating? You know, when? When hunters find them? Well, they're eating the environment that you are hunting them in. And he was like in Virginia, that's GMO crops. That's corn fields in all these these Soifer, that's all these these areas. That's the deer are eating the foods that we're trying to not eat. Like we're you know, that the point the point is, like they're eating the thing that you don't want to get in your diet that GMO crops and that is what they're eating and so even if it's better Do you still have to be thinking about it? Like, it's like, it's almost like you're damned if you do damned if you don't you just can't win sometimes because we've, we have a system that is broken. It's just not. It's not. It's not really taking care of our health. Right?


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  30:16  
Yeah, what happens if go ahead?


James Barry  30:19  
I was gonna say so even wild game are, are not as wild as you think. Right?


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  30:25  
Well, what happens if it takes more than one shot to bring it down? Oh, that's even worse, then you've got all those stress hormones flowing through their system, right? Yeah. Or, or what happens? If the I mean with the shot, you know, if it's a lead bullet, if it explodes, I know that you usually get rid of that part. You know, like, if there is some of that, but is lead seeping into other parts of the meat? Yeah, totally.


James Barry  30:52  
Totally. And, and that's, that's, of course, talking about wild. I mean, when you when you buy stuff from a store there, they actually use a stun gun, usually. I mean, they don't, they don't typically shoot the animals, they do it in a different way. The typical way to do it, the more humane way is they take a stun gun, they put it up against the animal's forehead, they stun it, and then they cut the artery to kill it right away. So it's technically out when they kill it. But of course, that you know, as anyone who's vegan will get up and say, it's not always true. Sometimes the gun misses, sometimes they the animals not fully knocked out when they do it's just so you know, sometimes it's not that humane. And, and that's, you know, that's actually a really interesting topic is like, Okay, so we're talking about this ancestral way of eating. But then where does humanity come into it? Like we talked about humaneness of killing, but is any killing humane, then what's fascinating about this is, once again, you got to talk to the real people, like you got to talk to the farmers because in theory, I know a lot of people who are vegan will say, Oh, well don't eat animals, because you're, you're killing an animal. And I just recommend you eat vegetables, okay? They, they're coming from that ethical standpoint. But if you actually talk to the farmer, that's, that's, that's fielding those crops. And I've talked to a few and they all say this, and when they said they, they have this kind of like, blank, like, this kind of like sorrows, though, you would see at a funeral, like, like something comes over the face when I talk about it. But basically, in any crop field, there are animals hiding in this crop from fond to rabbits to just all types of animals, that's where they that's where they live with. If they can get food in that crop. That's where they are. So when they go to then take, like, when they go to tear down those crops, and, and, and harvest them. All of those animals that are hiding in there get killed in its Carnage, it's like, there is no way around it like and I've talked to these farmers, like kids that grew up on their phones, they say, my, it's disgusting. It's like the amount of carnage that happens when they harvest the field is and the tools and the tills and the animals get caught up in it, and they can't escape it. And so this idea that one way of eating doesn't kill something. And the other in another way does is just false. This is not accurate. It's like something's gonna die no matter what. And so to me, when I when I think of that, I go, Okay, well, then what, when we talk about diet, maybe we're asking the wrong questions. Maybe we're talking about the wrong way. Maybe it's not about what's the perfect diet. Maybe it's more about, well, how do you eat? Maybe it's specific to you. And so I'm always just like, Look, I'm not here to like, like, yeah, I have a product out there that has already made it. And that's because I believe organ meats are incredibly nutrient dense, I believe we are nutrient deficient. And I believe we need these things back in our day. So I'm, I've created a way an easy way to get it. But I'm not telling you like you need like, I'm not trying to say how you're eating if you're choosing a naughty dog organ meats, or if you're vegan or vegetarian, like, I'm not trying to say you're eating wrong. All I ask is that you eat for what you want to do. Don't judge others for eating the way they want to eat. But if your body starts to communicate to you that what you're doing is not working. All I ask is you listen to that. So if you're a vegan, and your body starts to break down, or you have chronic health issues, or something's going on, listen to that, like don't become so dogmatic about the way you eat that you don't listen to your The, the the signs that your own body is giving you. And the same goes for meat eaters, if you're following the carnivore diet, and your your body is like you're constipated constantly and you're not in you're not in you're finding that you have issues around digestion or anything like that. Listen to that doesn't mean you have to abandon the diet but just listen to it and then reach out to a trusted practitioner and get support. Like figure it out. But don't, don't be so dogmatic about the way you eat that you you sidestep your own body's like communication.


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  35:09  
Yeah, thanks for saying that that's such an important point. And for so many humans, there is this disconnect, right? We're so cerebral in many ways, and we're not paying attention to the signals that our bodies are telling us. And so we may have this particular philosophy within our bodies saying this, and there is that there is that division, and that challenge that we have that we have to rectify in some way, most of the time, the head is going to win, until the body is screaming loud enough where we actually listen. And that's got a lot with our fatigue patients.


James Barry  35:40  
And I yeah, and I hope that it doesn't go on so long enough, you know, so long that you know, that your body is screaming to the point where now you're, there's no point that you get to that point of no return. You know, we talk a lot about that, in general and in, in agriculture, like there's talk that were, were only something like 2040, or 50. Not that long. I mean, like 2030 years away from the point of no return, if we don't change how we're doing our agricultural systems, you know, you hear that about climate change that we're, you know, 50 years away from like, a point of no return. And I think the same thing we're seeing in people's health, right, like, if you wait too long, there's so much you can do naturally, there's so much you can do that you can fix like as you're discussing your Fix your fatigue broken and your practice, there's so much you can do. But if you wait too long, sometimes you're out of luck. Like you're now you have to go that Western medical route, where they're like blasting your body with radiation or whatever it is to kill whatever is going on. And then even then you're you may not live for it like that may only prolong things for a couple years, you just don't know. And so I, I'm just a huge advocate of like, you know, we we want our eyesight starts going bad. Like when when we start seeing blurry lines, we go get glasses, right? We go we go to, we go to the we go get our eyes checked, well, I believe the same thing should be happening annually with getting blood tests, getting our hormones checked, like we should be checking our health before there's a fire, like, if there's smoke, like, you know, that you need to get checked. But don't wait for the fire, you know.


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  37:21  
Yeah, that's a really good point. And, and there are some markers out there, but there's a lot that we still don't know about, you know, prevention and whatnot. So we have to err on the side of what you're saying. Like we have to be eating organic as much as possible free range as much as possible. pesticide free, as much as possible, you know, decrease the crap out of our body and put in the good stuff, not just in our bodies, but also into our minds, putting, you know, like, let's stay away from negative thinking and news and all these other things, you know, let's get back to gratitude. So no matter what it is, we have to be moving in that direction at all times.


James Barry  38:01  
Absolutely. And and the more you can incorporate any of it and all of it in the better off like something I'm really an advocate of is Morning Morning. Routines, you know, like waking up same time every day. So your body acclimates to the time meditating when I wake up writing, you know, like doing these things that are going to help us with those kind of big pillars, you know, stressed sleep, nutrition and exercise, you know, anything that's going to help those.


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  38:26  
Yeah, I totally agree. Well, this has been amazing. James, thanks so much for joining me here today. And, and everybody, you're gonna check the links below, there's going to be a discount that you have $10 off with the code that you see below.


James Barry  38:40  
10% off.


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  38:42  
Sorry, 10% 10% I'm sorry, I misspoke. 10% off.


James Barry  38:46  
I wish I could get $10 off, but that would be.. I'd be losing money.


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  38:51  
Thanks for correcting me. So 10% off, click on the link below. Go check it out. I've been putting it on salads, you can put it on so many different things. And it's it's super tasty. So thanks so much for joining me here today, James.


James Barry  39:04  
Thank you and take care.


Evan H. Hirsch, MD  39:09  
I hope you learned something on today's podcast. If you did, please share it with your friends and family and leave us a five star review on iTunes. It's really helpful for getting this information out to more fatigued people who desperately need it. Sharing all the experts I know in love and the powerful tips I have on fatigue is one of my absolute favorite things to do. If you'd like more information, please sign up for my newsletter, where I share all important facts and information about fatigue from the foods and supplements to the programs and products that I use personally and recommend to others so that they can live their best lives. Just go to fix your fatigue.com forward slash newsletter to sign up and I will send you this great information. Thanks for being part of my community. Just a reminder This podcast is for educational purposes only, and is not a substitute for professional care by a doctor or other qualified medical professional. It is provided with the understanding that it does not constitute medical or other professional advice or services. If you're looking for help with your fatigue, you can visit my website and work with us at fix your fatigue calm and remember, it's important that you have someone in your corner who is a credentialed healthcare professional to help you make changes. This is very important, especially when it comes to your health. Thanks for listening and have an amazing day.

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